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On 24 Apr., 19:51, martin.hofh...@googlemail.com wrote:
> On 24 Apr., 18:13, Neil Ellwood <cral.elllwo...@bt.openworld.com>
> wrote:
>
> > On Thu, 24 Apr 2008 07:14:52 -0700, martin.hofherr wrote:
> > > On 24 Apr., 09:11, Neil Ellwood <cral.elllwo...@bt.openworld.com> wrote:
> > >> On Wed, 23 Apr 2008 10:59:46 +0200, MartinH wrote:
> > >> > Neil Ellwood wrote:
>
> > >> >> On Tue, 22 Apr 2008 17:19:53 +0200, Martin Hofherr wrote:
>
> > >> >>> Hello Everybody,
>
> > >> >>> I recently installed Debian Etch with a 2.6.18-amd64 Kernel on my
> > >> >>> Dell Dimension C521. Everything works fine except that from time to
> > >> >>> time the keyboard and/or the mouse freeze. It is still possible to
> > >> >>> log in via ssh but I can't restart kdm or X. Can this have to do
> > >> >>> with my Asus wl-167g wireless-lan adaptor(ralink rt73 chipset)?
> > >> >>> Neither /var/log/Xorg.0.log nor /var/log/messages report any error.
>
> > >> >>> Thanks, Martin
>
> > >> >> This may or even may not help but is worth a try if you don't mind
> > >> >> re- installing.
>
> > >> >> When you put your first disc in and restart wait until the first
> > >> >> screen and then press F1 - try install noapic nolapic and press
> > >> >> enter.
>
> > >> >> HTH
> > >> > Hi Neil, thanks for your reply I'm going to try that. When I
> > >> > installed I used the option acpi=off. Could this also have an effect
> > >> > on this problem?
>
> > >> > Martin
>
> > >> Yes it can help - helped me. Trust Dell to do things in its own wat
> > >> like ms. As you might guess mine is a Dimension 521 as well. --
> > >> Neil
> > >> reverse ra and delete l
> > >> Linux user 335851
>
> > > I reinstalled Debian now with the parameters noapic nolapic acpi=off
>
> > > And again... after two hours the mouse suddenly froze. Only this time I
> > > was still
> > > able to use the keyboard.
>
> > > Have you installed 64 bit or 32 bit version?
>
> > 64 bit. but am trying 'Ubuntu' with xfce at the moment and it doesn't
> > look as though I will keep it very long. Not a patch on Debian. I find
> > that I am not keeping the computer running as long as I used to so maybe
> > that is why it didn't happen to the last time I ran Debian (last week).
> > --
> > Neil
> > reverse ra and delete l
> > Linux user 335851
>
> I'm going to try fedora on another partition of my hd and see if I get
> the same problem
> there...

Same problem again.... the mouse and keyboard hangs in fedora too.
Maybe it is an hardware bug or a problem with X.org.

martin.hofherr@googlemail.com wrote:
> On 24 Apr., 19:51, martin.hofh...@googlemail.com wrote:
>
>> On 24 Apr., 18:13, Neil Ellwood <cral.elllwo...@bt.openworld.com>
>> wrote:
>>
>>
>>> On Thu, 24 Apr 2008 07:14:52 -0700, martin.hofherr wrote:
>>>
>>>> On 24 Apr., 09:11, Neil Ellwood <cral.elllwo...@bt.openworld.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> On Wed, 23 Apr 2008 10:59:46 +0200, MartinH wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> Neil Ellwood wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> On Tue, 22 Apr 2008 17:19:53 +0200, Martin Hofherr wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Hello Everybody,
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> I recently installed Debian Etch with a 2.6.18-amd64 Kernel on my
>>>>>>>> Dell Dimension C521. Everything works fine except that from time to
>>>>>>>> time the keyboard and/or the mouse freeze. It is still possible to
>>>>>>>> log in via ssh but I can't restart kdm or X. Can this have to do
>>>>>>>> with my Asus wl-167g wireless-lan adaptor(ralink rt73 chipset)?
>>>>>>>> Neither /var/log/Xorg.0.log nor /var/log/messages report any error.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Thanks, Martin
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> This may or even may not help but is worth a try if you don't mind
>>>>>>> re- installing.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> When you put your first disc in and restart wait until the first
>>>>>>> screen and then press F1 - try install noapic nolapic and press
>>>>>>> enter.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> HTH
>>>>>>>
>>>>>> Hi Neil, thanks for your reply I'm going to try that. When I
>>>>>> installed I used the option acpi=off. Could this also have an effect
>>>>>> on this problem?
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Martin
>>>>>>
>>>>> Yes it can help - helped me. Trust Dell to do things in its own wat
>>>>> like ms. As you might guess mine is a Dimension 521 as well. --
>>>>> Neil
>>>>> reverse ra and delete l
>>>>> Linux user 335851
>>>>>
>>>> I reinstalled Debian now with the parameters noapic nolapic acpi=off
>>>>
>>>> And again... after two hours the mouse suddenly froze. Only this time I
>>>> was still
>>>> able to use the keyboard.
>>>>
>>>> Have you installed 64 bit or 32 bit version?
>>>>
>>> 64 bit. but am trying 'Ubuntu' with xfce at the moment and it doesn't
>>> look as though I will keep it very long. Not a patch on Debian. I find
>>> that I am not keeping the computer running as long as I used to so maybe
>>> that is why it didn't happen to the last time I ran Debian (last week).
>>> --
>>> Neil
>>> reverse ra and delete l
>>> Linux user 335851
>>>
>> I'm going to try fedora on another partition of my hd and see if I get
>> the same problem
>> there...
>>
>
> Same problem again.... the mouse and keyboard hangs in fedora too.
> Maybe it is an hardware bug or a problem with X.org.
>


X.org is not the "same" in both distros. Also, software rarely acts up
after a certain length of time.

I suspect hardware. Try another mouse to see if it is the mouse, or the
mouse port. Hopefully is is a cheap mouse, and probably dieing from heat.

You can also use a serial mouse if you want to go that route for
testing, but if you do, you will have switched both the mouse and the
port hardware, so isolation is not likely.


--
John

No Microsoft, Apple, Intel, Trend Micro, nor Ford products were used in the preparation or transmission of this message.

The EULA sounds like it was written by a team of lawyers who want to tell me what I can't do. The GPL sounds like it was written by a human being, who wants me to know what I can do.

Neil Ellwood <cral.elllwood2@bt.openworld.com>:
> On Tue, 22 Apr 2008 17:19:53 +0200, Martin Hofherr wrote:
> >
> > I recently installed Debian Etch with a 2.6.18-amd64 Kernel on my Dell
> > Dimension C521. Everything works fine except that from time to time the
> > keyboard and/or the mouse freeze. It is still possible to log in via ssh
> > but I can't restart kdm or X. Can this have to do with my Asus wl-167g
> > wireless-lan adaptor(ralink rt73 chipset)? Neither /var/log/Xorg.0.log
> > nor /var/log/messages report any error.
>
> This may or even may not help but is worth a try if you don't mind re-
> installing.

Reinstalling? Why? Just reboot and supply it as a boot param. If it
works, add it to your grub config to make it automatic.

> When you put your first disc in and restart wait until the first screen
> and then press F1 - try install noapic nolapic and press enter.


--
Any technology distinguishable from magic is insufficiently advanced.
(*) http://blinkynet.net/comp/uip5.html Linux Counter #80292
- - http://www.faqs.org/rfcs/rfc1855.html Please, don't Cc: me.

On Thu, 24 Apr 2008 20:44:32 +0000, John F. Morse wrote:

> martin.hofherr@googlemail.com wrote:
>> On 24 Apr., 19:51, martin.hofh...@googlemail.com wrote:
>
>>>
>>>
>> Same problem again.... the mouse and keyboard hangs in fedora too.
>> Maybe it is an hardware bug or a problem with X.org.
>>
>>
>
> X.org is not the "same" in both distros. Also, software rarely acts up
> after a certain length of time.
>
> I suspect hardware. Try another mouse to see if it is the mouse, or the
> mouse port. Hopefully is is a cheap mouse, and probably dieing from
> heat.
>
> You can also use a serial mouse if you want to go that route for
> testing, but if you do, you will have switched both the mouse and the
> port hardware, so isolation is not likely.
I have tried another mouse and because I preferred it to the Dell one I
have stuck to it (Technika from Tesco) but still didn't cure the problem.
My belief is that it is a Dell set up problem but cannot find where. :-(
--
Neil
reverse ra and delete l
Linux user 335851

On 25 Apr., 09:37, Neil Ellwood <cral.elllwo...@bt.openworld.com>
wrote:
> On Thu, 24 Apr 2008 20:44:32 +0000, John F. Morse wrote:
> > martin.hofh...@googlemail.com wrote:
> >> On 24 Apr., 19:51, martin.hofh...@googlemail.com wrote:
>
> >> Same problem again.... the mouse and keyboard hangs in fedora too.
> >> Maybe it is an hardware bug or a problem with X.org.
>
> > X.org is not the "same" in both distros. Also, software rarely acts up
> > after a certain length of time.
>
> > I suspect hardware. Try another mouse to see if it is the mouse, or the
> > mouse port. Hopefully is is a cheap mouse, and probably dieing from
> > heat.
>
> > You can also use a serial mouse if you want to go that route for
> > testing, but if you do, you will have switched both the mouse and the
> > port hardware, so isolation is not likely.
>
> I have tried another mouse and because I preferred it to the Dell one I
> have stuck to it (Technika from Tesco) but still didn't cure the problem.
> My belief is that it is a Dell set up problem but cannot find where. :-(
> --
> Neil
> reverse ra and delete l
> Linux user 335851

I guess that John is right. It must be a hardware issue. I found an
biosupdate at the
dell homepage for the dimension c521 series. I installed it yesterday
evening but
haven't had the time yet to keep my box running for some time to check
if the
error occours again. Maybe it helps... at least it promises enchanged
compatibility
for usb devices...
http://support.dell.com/support/down...&fileid=220153

martin.hofherr@googlemail.com wrote:

> There is another change in the mouse and keyboard story....
> The biosupdate didn't help much, the mouse an keyboard froze again.
> But then I stumbeled
> eventually over this:
> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+bug/196902
>
> And until now it worked fine. Since I plugged an usb-hub at the rear
> usb-slots an connected
> the mouse to the hub it didn' t freeze anymore. Let's see how long it
> lasts...
>

Maybe I missed it, but I didn't see where they found any solution.

USB is funny -- I have a PC with two ports in the rear, and two in the
front. The front ones work fine for a digital camera, but they won't
work for a thumb drive. It needs to be plugged into a rear port to work.

I'm curious if it might me some problem (or omission) with USB supplied
power, maybe not getting through, or provided by, an internal USB "hub"
that feeds the front connectors.

I've always just worked around it, but may investigate it further some day.

That is something you might consider too: move your USB keyboard and
mouse to a USB port on the other end of the PC.

Of course using a PS/2 or serial mouse for a test would determine if it
is the USB port(s) or something else.

--
John

No Microsoft, Apple, Intel, Trend Micro, nor Ford products were used in the preparation or transmission of this message.

The EULA sounds like it was written by a team of lawyers who want to tell me what I can't do. The GPL sounds like it was written by a human being, who wants me to know what I can do.

On Apr 25, 6:06*pm, martin.hofh...@googlemail.com wrote:
> On 25 Apr., 09:37, Neil Ellwood <cral.elllwo...@bt.openworld.com>
> wrote:
>
>
>
> > On Thu, 24 Apr 2008 20:44:32 +0000, John F. Morse wrote:
> > > martin.hofh...@googlemail.com wrote:
> > >> On 24 Apr., 19:51, martin.hofh...@googlemail.com wrote:
>
> > >> Same problem again.... the mouse and keyboard hangs in fedora too.
> > >> Maybe it is an hardware bug or a problem with X.org.
>
> > > X.org is not the "same" in both distros. Also, software rarely acts up
> > > after a certain length of time.
>
> > > I suspect hardware. Try another mouse to see if it is the mouse, or the
> > > mouse port. Hopefully is is a cheap mouse, and probably dieing from
> > > heat.
>
> > > You can also use a serial mouse if you want to go that route for
> > > testing, but if you do, you will have switched both the mouse and the
> > > port hardware, so isolation is not likely.
>
> > I have tried another mouse and because I preferred it to the Dell one I
> > have stuck to it (Technika from Tesco) but still didn't cure the problem..
> > My belief is that it is a Dell set up problem but cannot find where. :-(
> > --
> > Neil
> > reverse ra and delete l
> > Linux user 335851
>
> I guess that John is right. It must be a hardware issue. I found an
> biosupdate at the
> dell homepage for the dimension c521 series. I installed it yesterday
> evening but
> haven't had the time yet to keep my box running for some time to check
> if the
> error occours again. Maybe it helps... at least it promises enchanged
> compatibility
> for usb devices...http://support.dell.com/support/down...?c=us&l=en&s=g...

There is another change in the mouse and keyboard story....
The biosupdate didn't help much, the mouse an keyboard froze again.
But then I stumbeled
eventually over this:
https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+bug/196902

And until now it worked fine. Since I plugged an usb-hub at the rear
usb-slots an connected
the mouse to the hub it didn' t freeze anymore. Let's see how long it
lasts...

On Tue, 29 Apr 2008 11:16:24 -0700, martin.hofherr wrote:

> On Apr 29, 7:21Â*pm, "John F. Morse" <xanadu....@example.invalid> wrote:
>> martin.hofh...@googlemail.com wrote:
>> > There is another change in the mouse and keyboard story.... The
>> > biosupdate didn't help much, the mouse an keyboard froze again. But
>> > then I stumbeled
>> > eventually over this:
>> >https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+bug/196902
>>
>> > And until now it worked fine. Since I plugged an usb-hub at the rear
>> > usb-slots an connected
>> > the mouse to the hub it didn' t freeze anymore. Let's see how long it
>> > lasts...
>>
>> Maybe I missed it, but I didn't see where they found any solution.
>>
>> USB is funny -- I have a PC with two ports in the rear, and two in the
>> front. The front ones work fine for a digital camera, but they won't
>> work for a thumb drive. It needs to be plugged into a rear port to
>> work.
>>
>> I'm curious if it might me some problem (or omission) with USB supplied
>> power, maybe not getting through, or provided by, an internal USB "hub"
>> that feeds the front connectors.
>>
>> I've always just worked around it, but may investigate it further some
>> day.
>>
>> That is something you might consider too: move your USB keyboard and
>> mouse to a USB port on the other end of the PC.
>>
>> Of course using a PS/2 or serial mouse for a test would determine if it
>> is the USB port(s) or something else.
>>
>> --
>> John
>>
>> No Microsoft, Apple, Intel, Trend Micro, nor Ford products were used in
>> the preparation or transmission of this message.
>>
>> The EULA sounds like it was written by a team of lawyers who want to
>> tell me what I can't do. The GPL sounds like it was written by a human
>> being, who wants me to know what I can do.
>
>> Maybe I missed it, but I didn't see where they found any solution.
> Sorry, I posted the wrong link. This is the right one:
> http://www.nvnews.net/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=82640 Sorry.
> Until now it works, but you never know.. I've had the same problems with
> digtial cameras too, only vice versa: Thumb drives
> where detected but the flash-card reader wasn't. I haven't tried yet, if
> it works now,
> after I installed Debian (before it was gentoo...) Maybe some module was
> missing in the
> kernel.
> Unfortunately I can't try a PS/2 or serial mouse, because the dimension
> c521 doesn't
> have neither a serial nor a PS/2 port. But I guess that it has something
> to do with the
> usb ports or the nvidia chipset.

There is a fundamental difference between front and rear usb2 ports on
most machines, if not all. The front ports often split the power
available, and they are often on an internal hub. The result is that many
devices that require high throughput will not run properly on front
ports. This often includes external hard drives and scanners and
sometimes printers.

On Apr 29, 7:21*pm, "John F. Morse" <xanadu....@example.invalid>
wrote:
> martin.hofh...@googlemail.com wrote:
> > There is another change in the mouse and keyboard story....
> > The biosupdate didn't help much, the mouse an keyboard froze again.
> > But then I stumbeled
> > eventually over this:
> >https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+bug/196902
>
> > And until now it worked fine. Since I plugged an usb-hub at the rear
> > usb-slots an connected
> > the mouse to the hub it didn' t freeze anymore. Let's see how long it
> > lasts...
>
> Maybe I missed it, but I didn't see where they found any solution.
>
> USB is funny -- I have a PC with two ports in the rear, and two in the
> front. The front ones work fine for a digital camera, but they won't
> work for a thumb drive. It needs to be plugged into a rear port to work.
>
> I'm curious if it might me some problem (or omission) with USB supplied
> power, maybe not getting through, or provided by, an internal USB "hub"
> that feeds the front connectors.
>
> I've always just worked around it, but may investigate it further some day..
>
> That is something you might consider too: move your USB keyboard and
> mouse to a USB port on the other end of the PC.
>
> Of course using a PS/2 or serial mouse for a test would determine if it
> is the USB port(s) or something else.
>
> --
> John
>
> No Microsoft, Apple, Intel, Trend Micro, nor Ford products were used in the preparation or transmission of this message.
>
> The EULA sounds like it was written by a team of lawyers who want to tell me what I can't do. The GPL sounds like it was written by a human being, whowants me to know what I can do.

> Maybe I missed it, but I didn't see where they found any solution.
Sorry, I posted the wrong link. This is the right one:
http://www.nvnews.net/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=82640
Sorry.
Until now it works, but you never know..
I've had the same problems with digtial cameras too, only vice versa:
Thumb drives
where detected but the flash-card reader wasn't. I haven't tried yet,
if it works now,
after I installed Debian (before it was gentoo...) Maybe some module
was missing in the
kernel.
Unfortunately I can't try a PS/2 or serial mouse, because the
dimension c521 doesn't
have neither a serial nor a PS/2 port. But I guess that it has
something to do with the
usb ports or the nvidia chipset.

Martin Hofherr wrote:
> Hello Everybody,
>
> I recently installed Debian Etch with a 2.6.18-amd64 Kernel on my Dell
> Dimension C521. Everything works fine except that from time to time
> the keyboard and/or the mouse freeze. It is still possible to log in via
> ssh but I can't restart kdm or X. Can this have to do with my Asus
> wl-167g wireless-lan adaptor(ralink rt73 chipset)? Neither
> /var/log/Xorg.0.log nor /var/log/messages report any error.
>
> Thanks, Martin

A year or two ago I played around with an Asus wl-167g wireless-lan
USB-adaptor. And this can very well be a major part of the problem. I
have not followed the development of the drivers, but back when I used
this adapter the keyboard and mouse froze whenever I unplugged the
adapter. And if your USB connection in any way has minor stability
problems, the keyboard and mouse can very well freeze even though the
adaptor is still plugged in. I chose to buy a PCMCIA card instead...

--
Best regards Jacob Tranholm <http://jtranholm.dk/>
Karl R. Popper: Observation statements and statements of experimental
results are always interpretations of the facts observed.