So anyway, it was like, 13:15 CEST Oct 26 2004, you know? Oh, and, yeah,
Sybren Stuvel was all like, "Dude,
> Jeroen Geilman enlightened us with:

>> GRUB is the bootloader of choice, LILO sucks donkey balls for most
>> people...
>
> Well, I've had more trouble with grub than with lilo. The latter
> always works for me.

I've had trouble with both from time to time, but I've always gotten
either to work in the end. That being said, I definitely prefer grub
since the functionality and ease of use (just not having to execute
lilo to install the config file each time you change something is a
blessing in itself) are way beyond lilo in any regard I can think of.

--
Time flies like an arrow, fruit flies like a banana. Perth ---> *
13:30:52 up 2 days, 54 min, 3 users, load average: 0.02, 0.02, 0.00
Linux 2.6.9 x86_64 GNU/Linux Registered Linux user #261729

Johan Lindquist enlightened us with:
> That being said, I definitely prefer grub since the functionality
> and ease of use are way beyond lilo in any regard I can think of.

Can grub set a default commandline for the next boot, which it will
forget after that boot?

> (just not having to execute lilo to install the config file each
> time you change something is a blessing in itself)

I just do "make install" in the kernel tree and that takes care of
everything.

Sybren
--
The problem with the world is stupidity. Not saying there should be a
capital punishment for stupidity, but why don't we just take the
safety labels off of everything and let the problem solve itself?

So anyway, it was like, 15:07 CEST Oct 26 2004, you know? Oh, and, yeah,
Sybren Stuvel was all like, "Dude,
> Johan Lindquist enlightened us with:

>> That being said, I definitely prefer grub since the functionality
>> and ease of use are way beyond lilo in any regard I can think of.
>
> Can grub set a default commandline for the next boot, which it will
> forget after that boot?

Maybe not. Never thought of that.

>> (just not having to execute lilo to install the config file each
>> time you change something is a blessing in itself)
>
> I just do "make install" in the kernel tree and that takes care of
> everything.

Ew.

--
Time flies like an arrow, fruit flies like a banana. Perth ---> *
15:40:11 up 2 days, 3:04, 3 users, load average: 0.00, 0.00, 0.00
Linux 2.6.9 x86_64 GNU/Linux Registered Linux user #261729

Johan Lindquist enlightened us with:
> Maybe not. Never thought of that.

It's really nice if you want to try out a new kernel.

Sybren
--
The problem with the world is stupidity. Not saying there should be a
capital punishment for stupidity, but why don't we just take the
safety labels off of everything and let the problem solve itself?

So anyway, it was like, 16:37 CEST Oct 26 2004, you know? Oh, and, yeah,
Sybren Stuvel was all like, "Dude,
> Johan Lindquist enlightened us with:

['kernel testing' mode of lilo vs grub]

>> Maybe not. Never thought of that.
>
> It's really nice if you want to try out a new kernel.

Remotely, maybe.. and that's assuming the kernel actually boots in a
way that gives you the opportunity to reboot and get the old one back
if something malfunctions.

However, since I can just make the switch from grub's command line for
one boot without changing the system at all, I don't really see the
benefit of lilo's ability to install a temporary kernel.

How does it work anyway? Does it change the boot sector and then
change it back while booting? I admit I don't know all that much about
lilo or booting in particular to discuss the finer points.

--
Time flies like an arrow, fruit flies like a banana. Perth ---> *
16:52:08 up 2 days, 4:15, 3 users, load average: 0.00, 0.00, 0.00
Linux 2.6.9 x86_64 GNU/Linux Registered Linux user #261729

Johan Lindquist enlightened us with:
> Remotely, maybe.. and that's assuming the kernel actually boots in a
> way that gives you the opportunity to reboot and get the old one back
> if something malfunctions.

Many remote systems have a remotely controllable power switch. It's
not only useful for remote systems, though. I don't want to have an
untested (by me) kernel set up as boot default. When I reboot to give
a new kernel a try, I do want just that, though, because I often
forget to choose my new kernel at boot time ;-)

> However, since I can just make the switch from grub's command line for
> one boot without changing the system at all, I don't really see the
> benefit of lilo's ability to install a temporary kernel.

You have to remember to do that when your system boots, though.
Usually when I can't use my system for a few seconds, I'm doing
something else somewhere else.

> How does it work anyway? Does it change the boot sector and then
> change it back while booting? I admit I don't know all that much
> about lilo or booting in particular to discuss the finer points.

I don't know exactly. My guess is that it modifies it's own code in
the boot sector.

Sybren
--
The problem with the world is stupidity. Not saying there should be a
capital punishment for stupidity, but why don't we just take the
safety labels off of everything and let the problem solve itself?

In alt.os.linux.gentoo, Sybren Stuvel uttered these immortal words:

>> That being said, I definitely prefer grub since the functionality
>> and ease of use are way beyond lilo in any regard I can think of.
>
> Can grub set a default commandline for the next boot, which it will
> forget after that boot?

Yes.

>> (just not having to execute lilo to install the config file each
>> time you change something is a blessing in itself)
>
> I just do "make install" in the kernel tree and that takes care of
> everything.

I've had LILO leave a system unbootable after upgrading a kernel and running
lilo. It's only happened once though.

--
Andy.

So anyway, it was like, 17:25 CEST Oct 26 2004, you know? Oh, and, yeah,
Sybren Stuvel was all like, "Dude,
> Johan Lindquist enlightened us with:

>> Remotely, maybe.. and that's assuming the kernel actually boots in
>> a way that gives you the opportunity to reboot and get the old one
>> back if something malfunctions.
>
> Many remote systems have a remotely controllable power switch. It's
> not only useful for remote systems, though. I don't want to have
> an untested (by me) kernel set up as boot default. When I reboot
> to give a new kernel a try, I do want just that, though, because I
> often forget to choose my new kernel at boot time ;-)

Seriously, if I'm trying out a new kernel, I /will/ be looking at the
machine as it boots. I will /not/ be off making tea for the seconds
it takes for it to shutdown and come up again, so I'm not all that
worried about missing my timing or forgetting to pick the new or
temporary kernel if that's what I'm planning on doing.

I doubt I'd actually test a new kernel remotely either, but I could
see the need for it. Assuming I had a serial console (or a pc weasel,
I'd love one of those pricey puppies) on the box so I could watch the
output during boot. Or if the box was next door so I could mosey on
over if it didn't seem to come back up again.

Not an ideal situation, but sure. I've done it.

[..]

>> How does it work anyway? Does it change the boot sector and then
>> change it back while booting? I admit I don't know all that much
>> about lilo or booting in particular to discuss the finer points.
>
> I don't know exactly. My guess is that it modifies it's own code in
> the boot sector.

I think I prefer making the change manually during boot, regardless of
lilo (or grub) having the option to install a kernel temporarily.

This is not quite on the topic of the original post any more tho, and
I do realise the skin usually looks the same no matter which method
you use on the poor feline.

--
Time flies like an arrow, fruit flies like a banana. Perth ---> *
01:12:43 up 2 days, 12:36, 6 users, load average: 0.00, 0.00, 0.00
Linux 2.6.9 x86_64 GNU/Linux Registered Linux user #261729

[typ.. gramm.. er.. whatever edited]

So anyway, it was like, 17:25 CEST Oct 26 2004, you know? Oh, and, yeah,
Sybren Stuvel was all like, "Dude,
> Johan Lindquist enlightened us with:

>> Remotely, maybe.. and that's assuming the kernel actually boots in
>> a way that gives you the opportunity to reboot and get the old one
>> back if something malfunctions.
>
> Many remote systems have a remotely controllable power switch. It's
> not only useful for remote systems, though. I don't want to have
> an untested (by me) kernel set up as boot default. When I reboot
> to give a new kernel a try, I do want just that, though, because I
> often forget to choose my new kernel at boot time ;-)

Seriously, if I'm trying out a new kernel, I /will/ be looking at the
machine as it boots. I will /not/ be off making tea for the seconds
it takes for it to shutdown and come up again, so I'm not all that
worried about missing my timing or forgetting to pick the new or
temporary kernel if that's what I'm planning on doing.

I doubt I'd actually test a new kernel remotely either, but I could
see the need for it. Assuming I had a serial console (or a pc weasel,
I'd love one of those pricey puppies) on the box so I could watch the
output during boot. Or if the box was next door so I could mosey on
over if it didn't seem to come back up again.

Not an ideal situation, but sure. I'd do it.

[..]

>> How does it work anyway? Does it change the boot sector and then
>> change it back while booting? I admit I don't know all that much
>> about lilo or booting in particular to discuss the finer points.
>
> I don't know exactly. My guess is that it modifies it's own code in
> the boot sector.

I think I prefer making the change manually during boot, regardless of
lilo (or grub) having the option to install a kernel temporarily.

This is not quite on the topic of the original post any more tho, and
I do realise the skin usually looks the same no matter which method
you use on the poor feline.

--
Time flies like an arrow, fruit flies like a banana. Perth ---> *
01:12:43 up 2 days, 12:36, 6 users, load average: 0.00, 0.00, 0.00
Linux 2.6.9 x86_64 GNU/Linux Registered Linux user #261729

Johan Lindquist enlightened us with:
> [typ.. gramm.. er.. whatever edited]

Lol

> Seriously, if I'm trying out a new kernel, I /will/ be looking at
> the machine as it boots. I will /not/ be off making tea for the
> seconds it takes for it to shutdown and come up again

Ok. Well, that's where we differ ;-)

> I do realise the skin usually looks the same no matter which method
> you use on the poor feline.

Yep

Sybren
--
The problem with the world is stupidity. Not saying there should be a
capital punishment for stupidity, but why don't we just take the
safety labels off of everything and let the problem solve itself?