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Hi,

Recently got an Ultra 5 to play about with. It came with an optical type
5 mouse, but no mouse mat. This means I'm slightly stuck since mouse
mats for type 5 mice seem to be hard to obtain and I can't find any
surface that the type 5 mouse finds agreeable.

I don't really care what kind of keyboard/mouse are attached to it as
long as it works; research seems to suggest that there's no easy way to
attach normal PC devices up. Is my only choice to get another
mouse/keyboard (there's a type 6 mouse/keyboard on eBay at the moment
which I assume would work)? I am loathe to do that since it would cost
nearly as much as the system.

Thanks for any help. I've only done serial console stuff with Sun
hardware in the past

Well i paid 6 Euro for a U5 system on german EBay just to get a
keyboard and mouse.
The pads are indeed not easy to find, adding a PCI USB card to your U5
is also an option and maybe less expensive as you can get them (the
ones with NEC chips) for 5 Euro. But it's maybe harder to configure it.

Chris Howells wrote:

> Recently got an Ultra 5 to play about with. It came with an optical type
> 5 mouse, but no mouse mat. This means I'm slightly stuck since mouse
> mats for type 5 mice seem to be hard to obtain and I can't find any
> surface that the type 5 mouse finds agreeable.

Do a search on 'postscript mouse pad'. Quite a few hits. Whether these
offerings work for Type 5 youll have to try. Let us know.
I kept my real one just in case : > but prefer the mechanical mice.

> Thanks for any help. I've only done serial console stuff with Sun
> hardware in the past

You could still do that of course. And probably will at some point.
And you can run headless and use X..

llothar wrote:
> Well i paid 6 Euro for a U5 system on german EBay just to get a
> keyboard and mouse.

I deliberately went for a system advertised with a keyboard and mouse so
it's slightly annoying

> The pads are indeed not easy to find, adding a PCI USB card to your U5
> is also an option and maybe less expensive as you can get them (the
> ones with NEC chips) for 5 Euro. But it's maybe harder to configure it.

Thanks, that's a good idea. Rummaging through my box of junk found a Via
USB PCI card; unfortunately that won't work, generating a mesage
complaining about lack of SOF interrupts on boot (sorry, seem to have
misplaced the actual error).

(Come to think of it, the reason the card was in my box of junk is
because it wouldn't work with Windows either)

I'll see if I can get NEC-based on cheaply.

gerryt@ wrote:

> Do a search on 'postscript mouse pad'. Quite a few hits. Whether these
> offerings work for Type 5 youll have to try. Let us know.

Ah, cunning. Printed it on a laser onto shiny 90gsm paper but
unfortunately it generates movement only in the vertical direction, not
horizontal.

Anybody have a photo of a type 5 mat so I can try to replicate that?
Read a posting which said it was more complicated than a type 4 mat,
though I have access to a colour laser, so hopefully doable...

If anybody's wondering what it looks like:

<http://gallery.chrishowells.co.uk/view.php?display=images/2006/7.5.2006%20Sun/IMG_7061.JPG&width=900&height=600>

> You could still do that of course. And probably will at some point.
> And you can run headless and use X..

That's actually a good point. Remote X would probably be considerably
more sensible. Still, I want to get this mouse working now

Chris Howells wrote:
> gerryt@ wrote:
>
> > Do a search on 'postscript mouse pad'. Quite a few hits. Whether these
> > offerings work for Type 5 youll have to try. Let us know.
> Ah, cunning. Printed it on a laser onto shiny 90gsm paper but
> unfortunately it generates movement only in the vertical direction, not
> horizontal.

Try turning the printout 90 degrees...?

gerryt@ wrote:
> Try turning the printout 90 degrees...?

The printout is just a grid, identical in both x and y directions, so
that doesn't help.

I would suggest getting a SUN mouse with the old "tried and true" ball. I
have a few of the optical mice and I will not use them ever since I got a
mechanical mouse. To me, it was a big difference

Check around, I was able to find a couple for $5.00 each.

Cheers

Chris Howells wrote:
> > Try turning the printout 90 degrees...?
> The printout is just a grid, identical in both x and y directions, so that doesn't help.
What you described sounds similar to when you turn a real pad on its
end.

According to Chris Howells <someone@example.com>:
> gerryt@ wrote:
> > Try turning the printout 90 degrees...?
>
> The printout is just a grid, identical in both x and y directions, so
> that doesn't help.

But the optical mice for Suns have gone through several
generations of evolution.

The original ones were a two-hole mouse with a very coarse grid.
(These were the ones with my first Sun, a 2/120.)

The next ones were two-hole with a finer grid.

The next ones were two-hole with yet an even finer grid.

The last which I have seen and used were equally fine, but
worked with a one-hole mouse, and had the Sun logo in one
corner.

All but the last depended on mouse pads with differing optical
properties in the vertical and horizontal bars. One set reflected
strongly in the IR, the other set in the visible. One of the two holes
in a powered mouse had red LED light visible shining from it, the other
had IR (so not visible).

On all of these, except the last, rotating the mouse pad 90
degrees would keep it from recognizing one of the two axes of motion,
hence the suggestion. But since your PostScript one is made purely from
toner, it could not work with the two-hole mice, even if it had the
right pattern. (But the right resolution of the pattern *should* work
with your one-hole mouse, I think. You might try scaling it up or down.

The two-hole ones tended to have a more rectangular look, and be
flatter than yours.

The one in your web page (showing the PostScript mouse pad)
looks to me like the one-hole design. There is another, which is ball
type, which looks the same from above. The model number on mine (of the
ball type) is "Compact 1".

There is also another style, called "Crossbow", which looks kind
of like a bar of soap squeezed in the middle to produce a waist.

All of these are interchangeable from system to system with the
exception of the first style, which had a RJ-45 plug instead of the mini
DIN plug used on all of the later ones prior to the USB ones. If you
use one of the older ones, you will need the appropriate mouse pad (the
resolution of the sensors in the mouse changed, while the external
appearance did not). The fine resolution pad for the one hole and for
the two-hole mice are not interchangeable.

Almost all of the older ones were made by "mouse systems", and
were offered for Windows machines as well, so you might find a working
pad for one of the older mice. I have used a mouse pad designed for the
PC version (on a flexible backing) in place of the aluminum backed ones
which came with the Suns.

FWIW, there have been cases of secretarys stealing the Sun mouse
pads (because they "looked cool") and trying to use them with the
ball-type mice which came with their Windows boxes. They didn't work
well for that at all -- and it rendered the Suns useless. :-)

So -- visit eBay and look for "Crossbow" and "Compact 1" along
with "mouse" and "Sun" and see what you find.

Good Luck,
DoN.
--
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