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OK, I have been searching online, haven't found this out, but I'm sure
it's really simple.

From reading online, as described above, it seems that I should be able
to have a floppy containing Lilo prepared to boot Linux or Windows (ME
in my case). My reasoning behind wanting this is I will be able to have
Windows load automatically, and I won't have to mess with boot
partitions, MBRs, and all other crap. I almost lost all my stuff once,
don't want to come close again.

Linux is already installed on other slave harddrive, Windows on master.
Just please let me have a disk that I can pop in whenever I want Linux.

The problem I've been having is that all directions for creating this
magical disk are done in Linux, which I currently do not understand or
have bootable. I would like to be able to make the disk in Windows.
Maybe a disk image could be sent to me, or something?

Aaron

Aaron <aaron.axvig@sendit.nodak.edu> wrote:
> From reading online, as described above, it seems that I should be able
> to have a floppy containing Lilo prepared to boot Linux or Windows (ME
> in my case).

You can but why would you want to?

> My reasoning behind wanting this is I will be able to have
> Windows load automatically

You could have that simply by naming it as the default in lilo or grub -
there is no need to use a floppy.

> and I won't have to mess with boot
> partitions,

You don't have to mess with boot partitions. But even if you wanted to
mess with a boot partition, what's the difficulty with that? You make a
boot partition and put your kernel image and boot map onto it. But why
not put your kernel image and boot map on the root partition instead,
and nt make a boot partition at all?

> MBRs,

You always have to mess with the MBR, since that's where the boot
code is SO what? You can always chaneg it back, or forward, or
sideways.

> and all other crap.

There is no "other crap".

> I almost lost all my stuff once,

No you didn't. Messing with the boot sector does not affect your data.
Messing with the partition table does not affect your data. You can
always put things back the way they were and boot the way you used to
and read the partitions you used to read.

> don't want to come close again.

Then start wanting to.

> Linux is already installed on other slave harddrive, Windows on master.
> Just please let me have a disk that I can pop in whenever I want Linux.

Then go ahead. But why?

> The problem I've been having is that all directions for creating this
> magical disk are done in Linux,

That's correct. There is no magic.

> which I currently do not understand or

Then understand it.

> have bootable.


Then boot it.

> I would like to be able to make the disk in Windows.


You can't. Windows doesn't have the utilities. The best you could do
is copy a preprepared boot disk image to the floppy in windows, using
some raw copy utility for windows.

But why use a floppy at all? You can boot linux from windows boot
manager just fine. You can either use loadlinux.exe to boot a kernel
image on the msdos partition directly, or you can add a linux boot
sector to the list of boot sectors booted by the win.ini file,
after creating the linux boot sector on a partition boot record and
copying it to windows as a file.

But all those solutions require you to have the tools. And the tools
are in linux. So you will have to boot linux.

> Maybe a disk image could be sent to me, or something?

No, maybe you could pick one up from your distro cd. Why don't you just
oot from the cd? It can boot a disk installation just fine, as can
windows.

You are going about this barse-ackwards, thanks to your superstitions.
Lose them.

Peter

Aaron <aaron.axvig@sendit.nodak.edu> wrote:
> Linux is already installed on other slave harddrive, Windows on master.
> Just please let me have a disk that I can pop in whenever I want Linux.
>
> The problem I've been having is that all directions for creating this
> magical disk are done in Linux, which I currently do not understand or
> have bootable. I would like to be able to make the disk in Windows.
> Maybe a disk image could be sent to me, or something?

I don't know which distribution of Linux you installed, but most of them
offer you an option to create a boot floppy for the installation.

Why don't you just install your Linux again and make use of that?

It's difficult to create a boot floppy for you, since that depends
not only on the kernel you use, but also on your disk layout, and since
you seem to be unable to boot your Linux right now you will not be
able to get that information.

On the other hand, if you can access your Linux by booting from the
CDROM, you could try to create a boot floppy from there. Read man
pages, try 'apropos boot|grep floppy'.

Yours,
Laurenz Albe

On Tue, 28 Sep 2004 20:40:49 -0500, Aaron <aaron.axvig@sendit.nodak.edu>
wrote:

>OK, I have been searching online, haven't found this out, but I'm sure
>it's really simple.

> mkrescue

'mkrescue' is part of the standard LILO distribution. Unfortunately, the 2.6
kernel is no so large that it will not fit on a 1.44M floppy.

> mkrescue --iso

will create a bootable CD image that can be burned with 'cdrecord'. But you'd
better have a BIOS that can boot from CD.


>
> From reading online, as described above, it seems that I should be able
>to have a floppy containing Lilo prepared to boot Linux or Windows (ME
>in my case). My reasoning behind wanting this is I will be able to have
>Windows load automatically, and I won't have to mess with boot
>partitions, MBRs, and all other crap. I almost lost all my stuff once,
>don't want to come close again.
>
>Linux is already installed on other slave harddrive, Windows on master.
> Just please let me have a disk that I can pop in whenever I want Linux.
>
>The problem I've been having is that all directions for creating this
>magical disk are done in Linux, which I currently do not understand or
>have bootable. I would like to be able to make the disk in Windows.

LILO is a Linux utility. It does not run under Windows.

>Maybe a disk image could be sent to me, or something?
>
>Aaron

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Aaron wrote:
> OK, I have been searching online, haven't found this out, but I'm sure
> it's really simple.
>
> From reading online, as described above, it seems that I should be able
> to have a floppy containing Lilo prepared to boot Linux or Windows (ME
> in my case).

Yes, it is possible.

You prepare your lilo.conf file (under Linux) to boot, just as you would
if you were booting off of the MBR. Then, you run the lilo command with
the -b option to write the boot loader to the floppy disk rather than
the device specified in the lilo.conf file. So, your lilo command would
look something like

lilo -b /dev/fd0

> My reasoning behind wanting this is I will be able to have
> Windows load automatically, and I won't have to mess with boot
> partitions, MBRs, and all other crap. I almost lost all my stuff once,
> don't want to come close again.

Sensible approach.

> Linux is already installed on other slave harddrive, Windows on master.
> Just please let me have a disk that I can pop in whenever I want Linux.

Doable with lilo

> The problem I've been having is that all directions for creating this
> magical disk are done in Linux, which I currently do not understand or
> have bootable. I would like to be able to make the disk in Windows.
> Maybe a disk image could be sent to me, or something?

Sorry, but lilo only runs in Linux. Perhaps a bootable single-floppy
distribution will help you get started. Try Toms Root Boot (at
http://www.toms.net/rb/ ). Download the .ZIP version, and you can build
the boot in MSWindows, then you can boot /that/ floppy and get access to
your Linux system to build a /real/ lilo boot diskette.


> Aaron


- --

Lew Pitcher, IT Consultant, Enterprise Data Systems
Enterprise Technology Solutions, TD Bank Financial Group

(Opinions expressed here are my own, not my employer's)
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On Tue, 28 Sep 2004 20:40:49 -0500, Aaron wrote:

> OK, I have been searching online, haven't found this out, but I'm sure
> it's really simple.
Yes it is, just few simple steps but HOWto docs contains more than
you need, and supposed tobe that way. You just gotta pick ones you need
from it, guess you don't read a lot usually
> From reading online, as described above, it seems that I should
be able
> to have a floppy containing Lilo prepared to boot Linux or Windows (ME
> in my case). My reasoning behind wanting this is I will be able to have
> Windows load automatically, and I won't have to mess with boot
> partitions, MBRs, and all other crap. I almost lost all my stuff once,
> don't want to come close again.
>
> Linux is already installed on other slave harddrive, Windows on master.
> Just please let me have a disk that I can pop in whenever I want
> Linux.
Ok here's more simple way.
hard code 'root device' using rdev command on kernel (either custom or
built one, but gotta tobe able to fit in floppy) Using cp command, copy to
floppy that's called boot disk without lilo
you just pop it into drive, it will boot in auto

now with lilo,
format floppy with fdformat, creat ext2 with mke2fs, mount it to ..say
/floppy ---now you have usable floppy mounted on the system
copy /dev/fd0, /dev/hda1234, hdb 1234( whatever disk devices you
have) copy kernel on the /floppy/boot, copy /etc/lilo.conf to
/floppy/lilo.conf == now you could specify location of all these when
you run lilo but those are the location lilo expects them to be
now in /floppy/lilo.conf, change line like boot=..mbr location or root of
device to boot=/dev/fd0
run lilo -r /floppy

and you might prefer boot with lilo, if you want to pass some parameters
to the kernel

> The problem I've been having is that all directions for creating
this
> magical disk are done in Linux, which I currently do not understand or
> have bootable. I would like to be able to make the disk in Windows.
> Maybe a disk image could be sent to me, or something?
Well It's possible. You could ask someone else with linux to make boot
image for you and write to floppy with rawrite something. But it's much
easier to make the disk in linux.
download rescue disk for you distribution from online, use it as boot
>
> Aaron

Thanks for the responses, especially Peter's, which contained a bit
more sass and sarcasm than I generally care for. But really, all the
others were a great help.

Thanks to Lew Pitcher for agreeing that it's good to not risk things
you don't have to.

Anyway, I have decided that once I wrap up some critical college
applications and essays that I have going on, I will jump in again and
boot Linux. It's just that I think it would be very bad to have to
fix my computer while I have things on it that I spent a lot of time
on. Of course, I could back them up (and do), but I like to work on
them too.

So, based on your combined suggestions and the sorry realization that
Lilo is not able to do anything in Windows, I will probably redo my
Linux install (shouldn't have to do it all over again), and see if it
will do something nicer than last time.

Thanks again,

Aaron

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Aaron wrote:
> Thanks for the responses, especially Peter's, which contained a bit
> more sass and sarcasm than I generally care for. But really, all the
> others were a great help.
[snip]
> So, based on your combined suggestions and the sorry realization that
> Lilo is not able to do anything in Windows, I will probably redo my
> Linux install
[snip]

That's an awful lot of work (and a bit of a risk) given that you now know of
other options that are less risky. Here's how I would do it...

1) obtain TomsRootBoot (in ZIP form) from the site I pointed you at
2) In MSWindows, build a TomsRootBoot diskette from the contents of
the tomsrtbt zip file
3) Boot tomsrtbt; you are now running linux
4) In tomsrtbt, mount your Linux partition to /mnt
5) chroot yourself into your Linux system
cd /mnt
chroot . /bin/bash
6) run lilo to build a Linux boot floppy
lilo -b /dev/fd0
7) exit your chroot environment
8) umount your hard drive
9) reboot, using the lilo boot disk you just built

- From that point on, you can just insert the lilo boot disk into your floppy disk
drive and reboot to get to your (current) Linux installation.


- --
Lew Pitcher
IT Consultant, Enterprise Data Systems,
Enterprise Technology Solutions, TD Bank Financial Group

(Opinions expressed are my own, not my employers')
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Lew Pitcher <Lew.Pitcher@td.com> wrote in message news:<aES6d.23609$tT2.1337683@news20.bellglobal.co m>...
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> Hash: SHA1
>
> Here's how I would do it...
>
> 1) obtain TomsRootBoot (in ZIP form) from the site I pointed you at
> 2) In MSWindows, build a TomsRootBoot diskette from the contents of
> the tomsrtbt zip file
> 3) Boot tomsrtbt; you are now running linux

Done.

> 4) In tomsrtbt, mount your Linux partition to /mnt

Step by step directions of what to type are really what I need. This
is what seems to really be frustrating me about Linux. In order to
get to an "easy" to use GUI like KDE, you have to know command line
things. I realize that this isn't true in most installation
scenarios, but still... Anyway, if you could list the things to type,
it would be quite helpful. I am familiar with DOS and have read about
using the Linux command line, but there is quite a lot. So, how to
mount?

> 5) chroot yourself into your Linux system
> cd /mnt
> chroot . /bin/bash

Hmm, maybe these are the directions I was looking for. My apologies.
Still, the above argument is applicable.

> 6) run lilo to build a Linux boot floppy
> lilo -b /dev/fd0
> 7) exit your chroot environment
> 8) umount your hard drive
> 9) reboot, using the lilo boot disk you just built
>
> - From that point on, you can just insert the lilo boot disk into your floppy disk
> drive and reboot to get to your (current) Linux installation.

That would be the best case scenario.

Aaron

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Aaron wrote:
> Lew Pitcher <Lew.Pitcher@td.com> wrote in message news:<aES6d.23609$tT2.1337683@news20.bellglobal.co m>...
>
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>>
>>Here's how I would do it...
>>
>>1) obtain TomsRootBoot (in ZIP form) from the site I pointed you at
>>2) In MSWindows, build a TomsRootBoot diskette from the contents of
>> the tomsrtbt zip file
>>3) Boot tomsrtbt; you are now running linux
>
>
> Done.
>
>
>>4) In tomsrtbt, mount your Linux partition to /mnt
>
>
> Step by step directions of what to type are really what I need. This
> is what seems to really be frustrating me about Linux. In order to
> get to an "easy" to use GUI like KDE, you have to know command line
> things. I realize that this isn't true in most installation
> scenarios, but still...

Naturally, this is frustrating, but it is unusual for most 'modern'
distributions. However, even MSWindows installs (I've done a few) sometimes
require commandline knowledge.

> Anyway, if you could list the things to type,
> it would be quite helpful. I am familiar with DOS and have read about
> using the Linux command line, but there is quite a lot. So, how to
> mount?

Assuming that your MSWindows filesystem is the first partition of the master IDE
drive on the primary channel (the likeliest case), then
mount -t vfat /dev/hda1 /mnt
should take care of it.

>>5) chroot yourself into your Linux system
>> cd /mnt
>> chroot . /bin/bash
>
>
> Hmm, maybe these are the directions I was looking for. My apologies.
> Still, the above argument is applicable.

Usually, installs go smoother than yours did, and these sorts of instructions
are unnecessary. Of course, in the analogous MSWindows situation, you'd /have/
to reinstall the OS, because there would be no other way to fix the problem.
Here, a simple set of commands can fix the problem in less than 5 minutes.

>>6) run lilo to build a Linux boot floppy
of course, this assumes that your /etc/lilo.conf was properly set up in
first place. You might want to copy it out and post it here, and we can
tell you what (if anything) to change. The only risk (now) is that, if your
lilo.conf file is incorrect, you won't be able to boot Linux from the LILO
floppy you are about to build.
>> lilo -b /dev/fd0
>>7) exit your chroot environment
at the commandline prompt, type
exit

>>8) umount your hard drive
at the commandline prompt, type
umount /mnt

>>9) reboot, using the lilo boot disk you just built
<ctrl><alt><delete> will do here.

>>- From that point on, you can just insert the lilo boot disk into your floppy disk
>>drive and reboot to get to your (current) Linux installation.
>
>
> That would be the best case scenario.

FWIW, I booted Linux this way for about 3 months before I trusted lilo to
properly build my MBR. It was a pita, but it did reassure me in the stability of
my Linux setup.

- --
Lew Pitcher
IT Consultant, Enterprise Data Systems,
Enterprise Technology Solutions, TD Bank Financial Group

(Opinions expressed are my own, not my employers')
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